Over priced housing market? Right here.
As I think most readers of the blog know, I live in San Diego now, as a result of having moved here a few years ago for the CCO job at SOE.
It comes as no surprise to me to see the news today that San Diego is easily one of the most overpriced housing markets in the country. By 70%, according to this particular table.
We still own our house in Austin, in fact, and were renting it out until recently (anyone need to rent a 4-bedroom with a pool?). But when we moved here, we decided that it didn’t make sense to buy; home prices had been appreciating dramatically but the speed of the appreciation was slowing. Back then, houses would sell out from under you in a few days. Now I look around and there’s houses for sale that have been on the market for weeks.
Culturally, San Diego has a very different vibe to Austin, and mostly doesn’t compare in terms of the things we like to do, with the exception of museums, where it definitely does better. We don’t go to the beach (in fact, the only times we have gone to the beach at all in two years were summer picnics at SOE).
It used to be that I thought the weather was the compensation. This summer, though, it’s been about as hot as it was in Austin. That’s a scary thought.
29 Responses to “Over priced housing market? Right here.”
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The housing market stresses me out. I don’t know how they can consider Seattle “Fair Value,” when there are only 9 areas left in King County that are affordable to middle income buyers. I suppose if they include Tacoma and its suburbs, then maybe that’s accurate. Certainly, our market is not as hot as California’s, though I’m worried about what happens when 5 years from now, we either get pay to send our kids to private school, or we get to buy an $800k house across the lake where the public schools are good. The public elementary school in our neighborhood — 36% of the kids are passing reading. No kidding.
Why not just move back to Austin, since you are not tied to SOE any more?
Moving is itself a significant expense at that distance (and with all the books we have!). And we don’t quite fit in that old house, either. But we’ve definitely thought about it.
Half Priced Books. It’s a good thing. 😉
But seriously, Austin’s housing is at least doable. That’s why I’d considered moving there a few years back. I don’t think I ever would’ve been able to stand the heat however.
Also, a correction: The elementary school in my neighborhood, the 36% are passing Math. 64% are passing reading, and 17% (yikes!) are passing science. Data thanks to School Matters.
I’m an advocate for moving the gaming industry to a nice rural place where I could actually afford to live.
Montana perhaps… or maybe Ohio. You know, somewhere that no one really wants to live.
Yeah housing markets slowed dramatically up in N california as well. In the Sacramento region its still hopping in some areas (Lincoln, Rocklin areas) mainly due to Bay Area flight (people moving out of the expensive Bay Area)to McMansions in the distant burbs (fortunately). Median price sits around 300’s here. Which means Bay Area transplants can basically sell thier house in say, Danville and move to Sacramento and pocket 500k and buy a 450k house.
But mostly its slowed down, houses sitting on the market 1-3 months with people unwilling to sell due to overinflated (expectations?) property values, from 10 months ago. We have massive redevelopment downtown and in the city core atm, with lofts, condo towers, and urban residential redevelopment going on all over in the core of the city. The focus being on Work/Live spaces, its good, Ive lived or been in so many other citys that dont have what we have here in Sacramentos urban area, big trees, wide streets, old painted lady victorians, great dining, shopping, ability to walk everywhere, great economic cross section and good tech sector….and best of all affordable. Probably why so many are relocating here….its kind of a cross between Portland and Austin really. One of the Best Kept Secrets in California (although its hotter than hell here in the summer, but hey 3 rivers cant be beat!)
Not that Im encouraging anyone to move here, oh no please belive we’re a cowtown (or as Phil Jackson says “barbarians”) its better we keep that image alive….otherwise we turn into San Jose East 🙁
PS: As to Gaming Industry, there is none here….which is suprising given the quality of life….would think gaming studios/companies would do well to be here.
Raph wrote:
The weather is odd this year. The highest temperature that my family has ever known in San Diego, having lived here for thirty-plus years, was about 120°F on the day of the Sony Online Block Party. The average temperature has been around 110°F. That’s not too shabby until you consider the humidity has also been at all-time highs, which means that you feel the heat more than normally. I can’t wait until we get back down to the 50°F mornings, 70°F days, and 60°F nights. Yesterday was nice, remaining at around 80°F. I don’t know what’s going on. Global warming?
Postscript:
Neighborhood Middle School: 68.9 Reading, 60.0 Math, ratio of Teachers to students 21:1
This isnt representative of the area. There is a lot of variance in schools in Sacramento.
More importantly, I find it curious that I should somehow feel “good” about a passing rate academically in the 60%, maybe the 80% should be the norm……dosnt say much for Californias education system I guess…
The elementary school (K-5) our kids go to is 77.7% for reading and 77.8% for math. 21.6 students per teacher. Schools were a big part of why we landed where we did out of all of SD’s neighborhoods — and we’re not even at our home school because of the student-teacher ratio. They were trying to keep it to 20:1, so we got bumped to another school that was slightly farther away (not much though — maybe an extra mile).
Allen – Comparitively, the elementary school that I went to in Redmond (30 mins. away by car), 91% are passing reading, 85% are passing math, and 58% are passing science. It’s important to note that 77% of the kids in my neighborhood’s public school are economically disadvantaged versus 9.3% of the Redmond kids. What that menas is that the people who can afford to send their kids to private school in Seattle do so. Seattle has one of the highest percentages of kids in private school in the nation. If that’s not a rave review of the public school district, I don’t know what is.
I think Montana or Ohio are great ideas. Idaho would work as well. Wisconsin might be a little cold for those of you used to Texas weather, but I’ve heard that Madison is a fantastic place to live.
Just FWIW, I’ve lived in Montana (Missoula, which is in the more scenic part of the state), and it isn’t that nobody wants to live there, it is just that to live there you need to be either rich or poor, because there are damn few ways to earn a living there. But it is a great place to live, if you like vast, empty, and beautiful. However, expect to drop back ten years in the amenities you are used to.
Your situation, Raph, sounds a little like what I went through when I moved out to California almost ten years ago, and I my feeling is that you haven’t quite made the transition to Californian yet.
When I moved from Chicago to the bay area, I missed everything about Chicago and the mid-west. Where was the deep-dish pizza? Where were the Chicago-style hotdog stands? Where were the neighborhood sports bars? Where were the lakes for my favorite activities like waterskiing and fishing? Not in the bay area, anyway. I’d drive all over the first few years, looking for mid-west style lakefront areas, only to find half-empty reservoirs they called lakes. We’d go into downtown San Jose looking for something like the lively neighborhood nightlife in Chicago – definitely not happenin’.
But after a few years, I stopped looking for lakes and started going to the beach, doing a little sailing on the bay, and got certified to SCUBA. Also picked up skiing, which we’d only done occasionally in Chicago, but now have started to do with the kids now that they are just old enough.
When you say that San Diego doesn’t compare to Austin for the kinds of things you like to do, it reminds me exactly of my feelings about California for the first few years. I still miss the lakes, having grown up lake-side in the mid-west, but other than that, wouldn’t trade California for any other place now.
Give it a while and see if you don’t evolve into a full-blown Californian in a couple more years. 😉
You know, if I weren’t tied up in a lease until next spring, I’d be asking you what the rental price is on that place. 🙂
You know the Bay Area is bad when my friends living there moved back to DC to buy houses. Coming from DC and Sydney, I had reverse-sticker-shock in Austin. The housing prices are really quite reasonable, here. This is the first time I’ve ever been able to afford living by myself, and the square footage of my apartment is larger than the three-bedroom house I own in Maryland.
I love Maryland, and I think some bit of my heart will always be there. There will always be things I miss about Sydney, too. Austin is in dire need of some sidewalks, for starters!
I guess some of the things that we value are a bit more entrenched than that. For example, live acoustic music. There’s just barely any around here, particularly not kid-friendly stuff. You have to go quite a ways. There’s exactly one series running, that we can find.
Similarly, we just can’t find decent bookstores. Seriously, anyone know of one in San Diego? Other than Mysterious Galaxy?
I doubt I am going to migrate away from those particular likes. 🙂 I do fully agree that California has its own charms. I like the more varied cuisine you can get here, for example.
Raph wrote:
There’s a lot of live acoustic music around San Diego, Raph…
You’ll have to tell me where. 😛 Almost none of the people we listen to make it here. The local singer-singwriter scene looks pretty small.
Regarding Austin…
http://gamasutra.com/features/20060724/henderson_01.shtml
Is this new, indie game company your (future) work place? 🙂
Raph wrote:
Looks are deceptive.
I’ll e-mail you some links.
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Well, as I told you in email, Austin is a strong possibility in my immediate future, 4 bedrooms is what we’ll need (any chance that’s 4 *plus* a room that can be used as an office?). So, what school district is it in, and what are you looking to get for it?
–Dave
My parents are realtors and over the last few years listening to them I’ve come to appreciate just how completely out of whack housing gets in some places.
Personally, I rather like Charlotte, although in ten years it’s going to be appreciated to the point where it may not be such a great place to move into, at least if things continue at the rate they’re going. Still, it’s a great town with lots of high-culture stuff to do, affordable, and mild climate. Not to mention beach 3 hours away and mountains 2 hours away – great spot…
The only thing that would make me want to move away from it would be a job in the game industry. There are a few studios out this way but not much….yet.
Hey, Dave, if you do come out here, I’ll buy ya a pitcher, somewhere. 😉
We’ve made the trek down to SD for live music before (from Long Beach). Not acoustic or kid-friendly stuff though. If you move a bit north you’ll find more music, slightly higher temperatures, and even higher housing prices.
IMO the best place in the US to live right now is in the northwest US. Particularly Oregon but also Washington. Lots of music, great people, fantastic weather (if you like of variation in weather and a bit of rain), it’s clean, there’s lots of great food and (IMO) the best microbrews in the country. You can go out to the beach, go hiking, or go skiing all without driving too much. And of course, the Northwest has the best bookstore on the planet (Powell’s in Portland). Plus the cost of living is (relatively) quite cheap. You can still get a house pretty cheaply and it’s only going to continue to raise in price as more Californians move in.
It’s just the getting a job there thing which is an issue. We’ll move up there once I have a job where I can work from home.
Ahh, well as a consultant I used to travel quite a bit (well to much actually) all over the states, mostly to state capitals though. Heres my take on a few of the places mentioned:
Maryland/New England: Awesome, to cold for a thin skinned Northern Cali farm boy though.
Midwest: Chicagos great, Ann Arbors Awesome, again the cold….eek. It was in Michigan one febuary where I learned that scarves really are not fashion accessories in same places, theyre a means of survival….
North Carolina: great place
Georgia: Savannah is heaven, humid heaven but heaven nonetheless
Texas: I was stationed in San Antonio in the Army, and my girlfriend at the time lived in Austin (this was around 90′) man that place was hoppin with music even back then, great town, great Bar-B-Que. Everything about it reminds me of Sacramento’s urban area, even the heat.
Pacific Northwest: Was also in Washington for a year (Ft Lewis), 91 in Seattle, well it was a great music scene then. A friend moved up that way about 8 years ago, sold his house here in Sacramento, and had a house built on Bremerton island. I dont think Ive ever been somewhere more beautiful than the Puget Sound in Summer. (its the best 35 days of the year, rest is drizzle 🙂
Sorry best bookstore on this lump of dirt is: Here
But Portland is very cool, and very wet, which is why its very green 🙂
When I can work from home again I will work from here this part of California for at least 6 months out of the year
350k will get you right on the Sea (with beach), that happens to have the best sport fishing anywhere. I went there last year in Sept. I cant think of a better place to live (realistically:)
About “turning” into a californian, I dont know much about that Ive always been one….but it does have an effect on people being here, especially up north…
That song with the quote about northern California is so true…I think its to late for me now though..
I too think developers should move to less expensive markets. Come to Michigan! We haven’t had a real winter in 15 years in my neck of the woods, and our college towns aren’t as redneck and scary to game development geek types. 🙂
I used to live in San Diego, for many years infact, and still travel there for work almost every week.
Summers were never all that great but better then they have been these last few. Fall and Spring are wonderful and seem to last forever.
But the real payoff comes in January when it’s 72, your in your shorts outside bbq’ing. Then you can call folks like Grimwell on the phone and just drop the ever-so-casual PWNED JOU! about the weather. Enjoy.
Damijin – I too thought that was a bonus to being in Louisville, KY. If you come here with a company that can sustain itself from the outside, then great. Ohio would be the same. Now when your gaming company needs talent or the need funding, you’ll have no choice but to look outside to cities that “get it” like Austin. Careful what you wish for there because a game company in one of those housing markets might not float without serious outside connections.
All that aside, if I was going to take 10 million and invest it in a game, I’d do it in one of the non-gaming cities. I think you can import the talent and as long as you don’t need investment the labor costs and such would give you a good edge on the competition. Why pay an artist San Francisco money when you can pay them half that wage and give them a better standard of living in Louisville or Dayton or any other midwest city in the country.
Corrected for applicability to sacramento 🙂
The really awesome thing about Sacramento is the talent pool for employees here and the affordability of housing relative to salaries. Which is why so many companies are moving here I guess…
Nyght- When people from SD call mde in Jan, and PHWN me about the weather, I usually respond in kind in summer, eh like when they start whining about the unbearable “heat”……:). Thats the payback for 72 degrees in January….
But the real payoff comes in January when it’s 72, your in your shorts outside bbq’ing.
Yeah — when I BBQ in January I have to wear sandals with my shorts. I bet you go barefoot. Polar Bear BBQ 4TW!!! BBQ is a lifestyle, not a weather based event!
YAY!!! cooling trends throughout CA 4tw! 🙂